Feministing founder Jessica Valenti approached her impending nuptials determined to avoid the sexist traditions so often associated with marriage. But she was surprised by the strong reactions from her friends, fans and anonymous commenters who called her a "ball-cutting cybersuccubus."Some think Valenti is trying to have her (wedding) cake and eat it, too, while others say, "What, feminists can't get married?" In fact, our own staff agrees to disagree. After the jump, two Lemondroppers present their cases.
Julie, Associate Editor: As a hardcore feminist, I'm often on the extreme (extreme!) left on issues (pro-choice, anti-gun -- you get the idea). But when it comes to marriage, not so much.
Yes, marriage is a hetero-sexist tradition fraught with tons of sexist ideals (women having to "obey" their husbands, for one, and losing their personhood into the terminology of "man and wife" for another). But! That doesn't mean that it's a tradition completely without merit. The deep bond and commitment that marriage signifies is deeply appealing.
I believe that feminism should be less about developing stringent rules for women and more about honoring women's freedom to choose how you want to live your life. If traditional marriage makes you happy, then you shouldn't have to worry about losing entry into the feminist party. Feminism should be multifaceted enough to welcome women who want to marry, and those who don't without judging or punishing anyone.
Emily, Contributing Editor: Look, I believe in the kind of kinder, gentler feminism that allows for happy homemaking and kinky sex practices, but I'm not sure there's any such thing as a sexism-free wedding.
Even if you manage to eliminate all the overtly sexist traditions like promising to "obey" and taking your husband's last name, you can't escape the fact that the institution itself was created and built on inequality. You can scrub away the part of the wedding where the bride's father "gives her away" to the groom, but you can't change the history of the institution.
And today, studies show marriage is still less beneficial for women, who report poorer mental and physical health in marriage than men, and continue to take on the lion's share of housework and parenting duties in the marital home. Whether you wear a white dress or not, it won't change the fact that marriage doesn't exist in society to benefit women -- it's set up to benefit men.
For those reasons, I'm afraid "feminist wedding" is still an oxymoron.
Tell us! Are wedding inherently sexist?
Amelia at The Frisky has some strong feelings on Jessica's situation, too: "Jessica, this is your wedding, not the feminist movement's wedding. You're getting married. You have nothing to be sorry for. Your wedding is about you, and him, and your family and friends, and you're fighting an uphill battle..." click here to read the rest.












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Saturday 02 May
By Janica Winn
Jonathan and James. have you ever heard of conflict resolution? It is actually possible for people to resolve conflict without relying on violence or authority. Obedience is for dogs not people in loving relationships. Marriage is a not a military institution. Nor necessarily a religious institution. My husband and I were married 21 happy years ago by a judge. We have a legal, social arrangement between equals and it's worked just fine for us and our kids.
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Saturday 02 May
By Jennifer
This is rediculous! Feminism is supposed to be about women being free to make their own chocies without the influnce of others. It's just stupid that because a woman classifies herself as feminist that she should have to justify her relationships and marriage to a man. I don't care if the woman has the biggest puffiest cupcake dress in the world, its her choice. Just because she's an author that writes about feminism doesn't mean she's required to be a feminazi.
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Saturday 02 May
By Sarah
I agree 100% with Jonathan. I am married and i obey my husband compleatly just as sarah did Abraham. As wifes we are called to serve our husbands with joy and obey them as wedo the Lord himself. The diffrence is that husbands are to lay down thier lifes for their wifes treat them with respect honor and love them as Christ does the church. When a man loves his wofe life this his rules shall not be hard to bear. Liek the Lords who yoke is easy and burden is light. My huband would never ask me to do anything self degrading or disrespectful because he loves me. And i would never go against anything my husband asked me to do because i know that he loves me and has my best intrest at heart. I am happy to obey my husband and be the helpmeet i was created to be it gives me more joy and satifaction than any career ever could. God created marriage and he knows how it is supposed to work. When both man and wife play their roles marrige can be compleat BLISS. =)
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Sunday 03 May
By VR Oswald
A wedding is what you make of it. My first wedding was small - 25 people. Tom and I walked up to the justice of the peace, no words were spoken about obedience by one or the other. We were pronounced husband and wife. I didn't take offense at the justice telling Tom that he may kiss his bride. My second wedding, less words were uttered. It was the mayor of Doylestown or said the basic words, do you take him and do you take her, and now you may kiss... Be creative. Or not.
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Monday 04 May
By G. John Marmet
The legal concept of marriage is a contract: mutually entered into between equals. That religions of taken other views on this concept is irrelevant to the underlying contractual nature of the institution. Once entered into, various property rights and other legal statuses follow for both parties. In the United States there are very few legal vestiges of an earlier, sexist time. At its earliest, the Christian Church did not permit marriages to be performed in church. Only the legal institution existed. This was early changed but does not alter the fact that marriage need not have anything to do with the sexism that religions bring to the table.
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Thursday 07 May
By Eric
i think that every relationship is different and hsould be settled on their own terms openly. Ther eis no way a blanket decision can be laid down for all of society.
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Friday 08 May
By lildoe
I have been married for 15 years and obey my husband. We have a great marriage and he is a wonderful man. Many people tell me how lucky I am. I think if you marry the right person, obeying is very easy. I had the word "obey" in my vows, much to the decon's dismay. It is not PC to do so. I waited until I was 29 years old to get married. Surprisingly, it angers many friends and coworkers that my marriage works this way. I do not preach about how marriage works or what works for marriage because everyone is different and different things work for different people. But, a lot of people I have encountered get really angery that I handle my marriage this way. It is almost like they think I am telling them they are doing it wrong. Which, the way your marriage is working for you is great and long lasting, then it is not wrong.
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Tuesday 12 May
By Shell
My parents didn't get married until I was 11 and they were together 25 years before that. If anybody obeys anybody in their relationship it's my father who obeys my mother. Honestly he couldn't survive without her(and from what I see most men couldn't survive without their spouses). I don't find marriage necessary and I don't plan on getting married. Though for everybody who says that wives should obey their husbands, this is 2009. Move on from the stone age.
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Wednesday 20 May
By Reality
Femenists approach seems alsways ends up in divorce, hating all men, and can trurn to lesbians for zexual needs it seems..
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Wednesday 03 June
By Alyssa McCarthy
Given what you just said, your screen name is quite ironic. If feminism (the pursuit for equality of women, not domination over men) results in divorce, then it is because the man is incapable of existing in a relationship of equals.
Wednesday 03 June
By Edie
Jessica, you can do whatever you want at your wedding. It's your (and your future husband's) big day! There are versions of the traditional wedding vows out there that don't include "obey" and that refer to the happy couple as "husband and wife," rather than "man and wife" -- mine were this way -- but most officiants will let you write your own vows if the standard vows don't work for you. Many of us, myself included, weren't "given away." Instead, my dad escorted me to the front of the church. My sister escorted her daughters. If a white dress isn't you, you can wear whatever you want. You can have the attendants you want, or none at all. You can have the music you want. You can adopt as many old traditions as you want and disregard the ones you don't want, or you can do something completely different. It's up to you, and you can do whatever you want to do to make your day special and memorable.
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Wednesday 03 June
By Mark
When my wife and I married, neither her priest nor my pastor ever said anything about obey. It was about love, fidelity, and trust.
We've been married 27 years this month. Never have I asked her to obey me, nor she me. What we do live out with each other is respect and in my case, awe of her. Love is the product not of our romance, but of years of struggle, and great times, of tears and failure, of laughter and enjoying each others company.
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Tuesday 09 June
By Joe
Monday 27 April
By PJ
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"In the relationship with my fiancee, we make choices together. When I am right, we follow my wishes, when he is right we follow his."
But what happens PJ, when both of you are absolutely dead certain that each of you is right? When you are both entrenched in your positions? Who yields?
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Tuesday 09 June
By Joe
Monday 27 April
By PJNeutralReportPositiveNegative
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"In the relationship with my fiancee, we make choices together. When I am right, we follow my wishes, when he is right we follow his."
PJ,
What happens when both of you: A. feel very strongly about something; B. are both entrenched in your positions; C. don't want to yield?
Who "wins" at that point?
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Tuesday 09 June
By Shannon
Why are all of you arguing? No two relationships are the same and there is no one right way to be in a marriage. There could be 2 identical couples whose relationship is alike and one of them could end up divorced while the other dances at their 50th anniversary. My husband and I are best friends, who give each other freedom and support and total trust. We sometimes take separate vacations and don't spend all our time together but we are totally in love. I didn't take his last name and he is fine with it. The only people I get criticism from usually are the people in unhappy relationships which one or both of them are cheating on the other. There are some women who keep men on a tight leash and I don't agree with it, but I would never tell that woman she is wrong, and there are some guys out there who like that. Stop fighting and just try to keep your own relationship afloat before you tell somebody else what is wrong with theirs. To the person who said "what a cun* I hope her husband gets out" you will most likely be the one to get dumped, because what goes around comes around and you shouldn't wish things on people you know nothing about, you are most likely no prized piece yourself.
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Tuesday 09 June
By Sara
Thanks for saying that, Julie. I've known a lot of women who think I'm feeding into sexism by being a stay home mother. I had a social worker tell me I was too smart to waste my life barefoot. Do you have any idea how angry that makes me? I choose to stay home. I don't see how raising my children and caring for my family is a waste. My husband works two jobs so that I can stay home. I take care of him because he takes care of me, that's a partnership. That's the job I chose when we were married. I don't think poorly of a woman who chooses a career, but it doesn't mean that I'm not as intelligent because I didn't.
In my wedding, my husband and I wrote our own vows. There was no "obey" anywhere in the thing. If you take the religion out of it, marriage is nothing more than a business contract between two parties. That's why there's a contract. In the contract you sign, it's all about the "worldly goods", not about how much you love each other. Just because you engage in the tradition, that doesn't mean you're engaging in the ideology. It's all about what it means to you.
And Jessica, wow. That's awesome. I would love to be called a ball-cutting cybersuccubus. That's cool as hell. When I did work outside the home, the inmates never came up with anything that creative. I applaud you.
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Thursday 11 June
By Frank
so...Men commit to one woman in marriage...and its completely only the men that benefit from Marriage? How about the children that come from marriage? what about setting up a safe secure environment for children to live in and grow up in, in order to become contributing members of society? IF you think about it, Marriage is almost antithetical to what men, by their lower nature, want. One woman. for the rest of their lives. To me, a woman and man should be incredibly greatful that the opposite sex would actually enter into an institute like marriage, promising eachother to always be committed to eachother to the exclusion of every other human on the planet.
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